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Meta / metaphysics
This is the channel for the discussion of metaphysical and parapsychological subjects. Please keep discussion of these topics to this channel and out of the rest of the server.
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Unfastened Belts 10/20/2020 3:47 AM
So this conceptual framework I love to talk about really describes a two-fold process towards happiness (= peace of mind)
3:48 AM
One half is the "recognition of non-doership (every action determined by genetic design & conditioning)" or, in more flowery words, "recognition that there is only God's will", which is the half I keep blabbering on about
3:49 AM
The reason I don't talk about the second half as much is that it's much harder to describe with words
3:49 AM
But it bears at least some mentioning
3:51 AM
The recognition that your "nature", your "core", the only part you can ever know really exists, the formless layer below all the other layers of life experience, is consciousness
this 1
3:52 AM
Described as formless awareness coupled with the impersonal sense of "I am"
3:52 AM
Consciousness is inherently peaceful, self-contenting
3:53 AM
It cannot think, it can only be conscious
3:55 AM
Unhappiness, the sense of being unfulfilled, the "psychological me", is a layer of thoughts that arise in addition to the physical objects we're aware of
3:56 AM
They create this inner discomfort that pervades the life experience (either intensely or subtly, but nonetheless constantly)
3:57 AM
The sense of "I need to be somewhere else, this moment isn't good enough"
3:58 AM
One half of the process is to recognize that the thoughts are based on a misperception of being an independent, separate doer of life. The other half is to recognize that our very nature is peaceful, unchanging, formless
4:04 AM
Consciousness is often described as having its home in the heart/chest
4:05 AM
Part of the process is described as "consciousness sinking from the head into the heart"
4:05 AM
For the past few months I've kind of felt it in my throat
4:06 AM
Probably sounds hella weird but shrugs
4:06 AM
Kinda cool?
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the interesting thing is that I don't describe or feel consciousness as a basal layer, but a highly emergent one and a fickle one
11:19 AM
Perhaps it comes from my experiences around severely and moderating disabled human beings
11:20 AM
But I don't think any sort of awareness or understanding or even "self" comes innately at a deep level
11:23 AM
Our cell's organelles are pretty much undoubtedly chemically driven machines, but the cells made from organelles are already at a level of complexity greater than certain forms of "life" i.e. simple bacteria then cells to tissues, and tissues to organs, organs to organ systems, and organ systems to an organism (like a human!) at every level, there's a big jump in emergent behaviors Just like how one ant is pretty simple, but get a bunch of ants interacting and they can make anthills, tunnels, etc
11:25 AM
And honestly the ability to freaking breathe and just grunt when in pain is incredibly complex- we can't make a robot do any of those things in the same manner as a mammal or reptile
11:28 AM
but I'll be coolly dismissive of that, because go look at a small mouse and, past any anthropologic bias, tell me how deeply you think a mouse is conscious I don't think a mouse really understands what it is to be, I don't think functions like breathing and pain sensation and drives like "find food eat food" are "good enough", really
11:34 AM
and in the same sense, although this might be even more cruel to say lol, I don't think consciousness is innate to humans, because things can get FUBAR'd quickly- it would only take about 5 minutes without air to pretty much turn your brain to mush, and even better than damaged brains (which may have "flickers" or a warped but still existing experience), take someone who is born severely disabled and doesn't talk outside of making noises when agitated and doesn't intentionally use body language and maybe isn't even aware or in control enough of their body to execute "put food in mouth" or "pee in toilet only" The magical property and/or entity of consciousness that we talk about when we talk about "that thing in my head/heart" or call a "soul" is a fickle and highly emergent beast, layers above basal living functions
11:37 AM
I mean consciousness in the sense of the sort of things you're describing: thoughts about if something is wrong/right, good/bad, evil, just, fulfilling, satisfactory, abstract things that aren't just short-term "owie" or "sugar good!" that an ant can 'experience'- I'd assume your sensei wouldn't say that a human can prevent themselves from flinching away when they touch something burning hot, I assume when he's talking more along the lines of "depression" as an affliction on the level of consciousness (edited)
11:38 AM
Well I got a cure for anyone's depression- mentally retard yourself to the level of an ant- ants don't get depression! /j
11:39 AM
This is all just to say, I can't get on the Roger Castillo boat because I disagree with his fundamental ideas, the things he posits "there is a basal layer of consciousness that is your nature/core and is the only thing you know" - my view of consciousness is that it's the opposite of basal, it's the highest, most emergent layer (edited)
11:40 AM
That's not how I've experienced the world
11:40 AM
So the rest of it, the "so you should do this" falls apart
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Unfastened Belts 10/20/2020 5:18 PM
Interesting thoughts, will reply later
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Abvieon {Alex} 10/20/2020 7:49 PM
The way I see, it, personality and identity is an emergent property of consciousness, and consciousness is not only the "base layer" of the mind, but everything else, including physical reality. Imagination and the physical world are made of the same thing, it's just that the physical world is on a different wavelength/vibration and is "denser" and harder to manipulate without direct physical action. Changing your physical reality and circumstances using your mind alone can be done but will have delayed results, unlike in your imagination. It will also work through methods that operate according to the laws of physics, so for example if you want a free cup of coffee it won't pop into existence in front of you out of thin air, you'll instead unconsciously bring about a chain of events that result in somebody buying a cup of coffee for you, or you "just happen" to walk by a coffee shop giving out free cups of coffee that day or something. It works this way because of an inherent connection between all people/things, the universe is like an infinite chain of gears where it's impossible for one to move in isolation of any of the others. Look into the law of attraction. Obviously these are highly metaphysical views, but that's what this channel is for.
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Abvieon {Alex} 10/20/2020 7:59 PM
But just wanting something isn't exactly what causes this mechanism to kick into gear. Because the very act of wanting something implies that you don't have it. The universe can also be compared to a mirror, it will reflect your internal state. So if you continuously think "I don't yet have this!" It will continue to re-create that experience for you. The way to use the law of attraction is to immerse yourself in the feeling of already having something. Think of it as being in the present, not the future. (edited)
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Abvieon {Alex} 10/20/2020 8:23 PM
Dang, I write a lot while caffeinated. 😆
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@Olyndra If you want to list off a couple experiences and then ping me
9:53 PM
Please try to separate "I saw this happen" vs "I have emotions from this"
9:53 PM
For my purposes, emotions == spiritual confirmation, and "I Saw this happen" would be like, watching some person telikinetically bend a spoon (edited)
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Reality is both what you perceive and not not what you perceive
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Okay, so my experiences are kind of hard to describe. The first parts are easier, though, so I'll start there. The first one is: me and my girlfriend were having our tulpas talk via Discord and they were having an RP to interact, but it got interrupted by tactile sensations they both started having, which I perceived from feeling it through my mental connection with my tulpa and the text conversation coming from my girlfriend's account. These tactile sensations were consistent with things our tulpas were doing from that point on.
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power of suggestion
10:01 PM
probably the keyboard
10:01 PM
big tactile sensation on my fingers when i type
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Well, the first suggestion was after my girlfriend said 'why do I feel a weird tingling sensations? What's going on?'. But that was after I already felt it. As for future possibility of suggestion, I did try a double blind test by asking where something was felt and not giving that away and somehow, it was still very consistent.
10:03 PM
And actually, even the 'tingling sensations' part might have been something I asked and she said yes.
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where was the tingling sensation
10:05 PM
and would you describe it as a warm tingling or more like a numb tingling
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Forehead, but also on sexual organs, which only really correlated with the type of RP. But on top of that, my tulpa at one point said through text 'I think I can see you' to my girlfriend's tulpa, which then was tested by Serenity asking what he looked like and what pose he was in, which Serena got shockingly accurate.
10:05 PM
numb tingling.
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by numb tingling i mean like the feeling you have if your leg falls asleep
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yeah, but without the numbness.
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the same kind of tingle, but no numbness in those parts.
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tested by Serenity asking what he looked like and what pose he was in, which Serena got shockingly accurate.
I find this part interesting
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probably one of those confirmation bias type things where if you get parts of it right, suddenly it seems like you were a lot more accurate than you really were
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I've had some weird astral projectioney run ins myself but- like I said earlier, there's multiple interpretations of something like this
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Keep in mind, I had only heard his appearance as 'hard to get right' by my girlfriend in prior conversations.
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or one of those things where the other party really wanted it to be right, so it suddenly becomes right (edited)
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That too
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Well, no, we were trying to debunk it most times, actually.
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then probably the former
10:08 PM
like cold reading
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awwww yissss cold reading
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also the tingling thing sounds like arousal
10:09 PM
cough
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Skepticism sucks the fun aspect out of most everything.
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yes, but how was it accurate in both appearance and pose unless they changed their appearance and pose with regards to what Serena said, but I felt like him intentionally doing that to say yes is kind of far reaching.
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reality does that a lot unfortunately
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plus arbitrary start/stop points of the test, limitation of likely possibilities
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they dont necessarily need to change anything to say yes
10:10 PM
for example
10:10 PM
"yes"
10:10 PM
see i didnt change anything
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It's not really a valid scientific test but that's also not saying a lot
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I think skepticism usually makes it more fun, usually the reality is even weirder and more interesting Not always tho
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astronomy is fun
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admittedly true with regards to just 'yes', but my girlfriend also said it was true, and since then, we've been getting closer together and she's freaked out by it a lot, so I doubt she lied. (edited)
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pretty much everything else that isnt creative is boring
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or her tulpa
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wdym closer together
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So maybe it's true
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we were long distance before that.
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shrugs
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also, ACTUALLY that test was only single blind if I read it right
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^
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maybe she just doesn't like being near you and thats why she's freaked out 😛
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And it was single blind in abstract terms
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Not concrete ones
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the questioner could be giving information away in the way they ask the question, tone of voice, etc Look up "Clever Hans"
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no it wasn't single blind, because I did blind tests by asking Serena to try stimulating my girlfriend's tulpa in specific places and it did yield answers that resembled where she touched and how. (edited)
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But I mean I could say the same bullshit about tulpas so
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  • even unwittingly, I mean
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Whatever, forget the test
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that's single blind. Only she was blinded. The observer wasn't
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math horse
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or questioner in this case
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Well, then single blind both ways.
10:13 PM
isn't that still comparable to doing double blind?
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Gentle reminder that feelings aren't actually real 😂
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